[TooRisky]

WASRT made a run into new territory that is unmarked on any map, the path took us back about 5 miles off any beaten path. We set up the research camp and added 2 salmon baited mics about 200' from camp... At about 5:00am I awoke to this sound coming through the powered mics... I looked in the direction of the mic but the fog had rolled in so thick that I was unable to see more than 50-80 feet into it.

I have cleaned up the white noise and shortened the all night audio for space and time... Other ways the audio is unaltered in any way and we have the original full length audio.

Upon listening it appears to be 2 unknown "Creatures" at the bait site, maybe a youngster and parent of whatever species. There seems to be some complaining and then what sounds like bi-pedal movement away from the site...

Remember this is in the Washington Cascades where there are no hogs/pigs so that can be discounted... I can stretch to hear canine but the grumbling/mumbling is what really throws me...

Well have at it...

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=iZf1aVyvdOw

2R

[Melissa]

TooRisky.

Did you find any tracks or anything near the bait pile? How long is the original audio file?

Odd audio for sure. The deeper sound (I would think) could be done by an elk, but there is something else in there that sounds more chimp like. How much work did you have to do, re: cleaning?

[TooRisky]

Melissa, on 18 July 2010 - 01:17 PM, said:

TooRisky.

Did you find any tracks or anything near the bait pile? How long is the original audio file?

Odd audio for sure. The deeper sound (I would think) could be done by an elk, but there is something else in there that sounds more chimp like. How much work did you have to do, re: cleaning?

Well for tracks, we in this area find it hard to get tracks because of the years of pine, leaf and other debris that in places is feet deep and materess like... So no prints...

The only thing I did to the audio was use audacity to filter out the white noise (works great) and cut the audio short... I can put up the original if anyone wants to compare...

We record to a 6 hour audio device, we start it when we set the bait and change out at midnight and 6:00am and every 6 hours from there...

I have never heard an Elk make that kind of noise, though there are plenty about... we were using canned salmon and do not think any thing but a meat eater would be interested... I am just baffled and running out of animals except for... yah dont want to say it yet, but sure fits doesnt it...

Here is the cut from original bite of audio that is not altered in any way for analysis...

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=zOU9-AJOqrE

2R

This post has been edited by TooRisky: 18 July 2010 - 04:25 PM

[Melissa]

Thank you for posting that unedited audio.

Was any of the Salmon touched?

[TooRisky]

Melissa, on 18 July 2010 - 05:48 PM, said:

Thank you for posting that unedited audio.

Was any of the Salmon touched?

Thats another interesting thing...We open the can and leave just a little of the lid attached, we spread around the juice and put the lid back... When we went to look at the bait after waiting for like 2 hours to see if they would return, the lid was pushed down into the can preventing the meat to be eaten...LOL like a Chinese thumb trap. We think what ever heard me roust awake and headed out... So some was gone to baiting the area and seems none was gone from the can but the lid was pushed in preventing and eating... and the can standing straight up...

We are not sure if the can was moved from the starting location, but was in the general area we left it...

I would also think if it was canine (coyote/fox etc.) they would have come back for an easy meal, totally irresistible and we know they love the bait...

[Washingtonian]

If it was only the deeper sound I would be thinking bear. The higher pitched voice doesn't sound like a bear cub at all. Here is a web site that has a list of bear sounds with lots of bear cub sounds.

Add to that the information about the canned salmon - the can being left upright and a bear is even more doubtful. Bears will tear apart anything even at the whiff of food.

Too bad it was so foggy, you might have caught a glimpse of what it was.

[TooRisky]

Washingtonian, on 18 July 2010 - 08:08 PM, said:

If it was only the deeper sound I would be thinking bear. The higher pitched voice doesn't sound like a bear cub at all. Here is a web site that has a list of bear sounds with lots of bear cub sounds.

Add to that the information about the canned salmon - the can being left upright and a bear is even more doubtful. Bears will tear apart anything even at the whiff of food.

Too bad it was so foggy, you might have caught a glimpse of what it was.

You being from here know how baffled I am as to what is making these sounds... There is no way I can pull the trigger and say what I think... Well the best we can do I guess is keep it in the unknown and hope for a second recording to show up and compare... We are in this area now but it is rough to get into and has already destroyed one tire and I am sure will take its toll even more, the more we go back to it...

[Sascott]

Yea that is an odd recording. Could it be a member of the weasel family? My younger brother's friend had farrets and they sounded similar to what you recorded. Other than that I have no idea.

Scott

[Wammy]

How's come I knew the food wasn't touched. That is odd to say the least. I don't know of anything in NA, that sounds quit like that. As a pair anyway.

[Melissa]

I agree with Sascott.. Beats me..

TooRisky, you said the lid was pressed in, on the salmon. Did you find any prints, hair or anything else?

[imonacan]

TooRisky, on 18 July 2010 - 05:00 PM, said:

I am just baffled and running out of animals except for... yah dont want to say it yet, but sure fits doesnt it..

I've gotten to know that feeling, along with the time and frustration, to try and figure out just what was recorded...when you come across sounds like this, in your audio files. Sometimes, you just can't. This, would encourage me to return to that same area.
I don't hear any difference (from the sounds in question) in the unedited version, or the version you removed the white noise. I agree, that the lower grunts could be a known animal, but the higher (chimp like) sounds are something I've never heard before in the forest, although I've never been to Washington state ;) . I've found (at times) it difficult to tell, bipedal from quadrupedal movements on audio recordings. Thanks for sharing this interesting audio, and keep up the good work and efforts. Blazing into these (well off the beaten path areas), and setting up...is good strategy (IMO), for taking the investigations to where the creatures might be, more often.

[tapemaster]

I have uploaded a WAV copy of this to my audio site.Was able to get most of the buzzing removed.Can hear the steps a little better but not much.It will be the last clip in the list.

http://sites.google....rch/audio-clips

Rick

[TooRisky]

tapemaster, on 19 July 2010 - 03:15 PM, said:

I have uploaded a WAV copy of this to my audio site.Was able to get most of the buzzing removed.Can hear the steps a little better but not much.It will be the last clip in the list.

http://sites.google....rch/audio-clips

Rick

Well glad ya like it so much as to alter it from what I put up... Now I did not make it clear that if one was to use it, it would be used in its "Original Condition", but that seems to be unspoken... please ask next time, though I did not ask to, but will in the future...

ya see to control the quality of possible evidance, ya just cant make alterations, rip it from the original condition and present it... Every little bit of altering, how ever small, will throw doubt on it... always has and always will.

[tapemaster]

TooRisky, on 20 July 2010 - 12:32 AM, said:

Well glad ya like it so much as to alter it from what I put up... Now I did not make it clear that if one was to use it, it would be used in its "Original Condition", but that seems to be unspoken... please ask next time, though I did not ask to, but will in the future...

ya see to control the quality of possible evidance, ya just cant make alterations, rip it from the original condition and present it... Every little bit of altering, how ever small, will throw doubt on it... always has and always will.

My apologies for offending you.I will delete it at once.

[TooRisky]

tapemaster, on 19 July 2010 - 09:46 PM, said:

My apologies for offending you.I will delete it at once.

No need... I should have made it clear to keep it in the condition I sent it in as...but we are also committed to sharing our info with the public and researchers for the benefit of all... Just dont alter it is the point...

I know it was in the .wmv format, and that is to give credit to the people that work so hard, in very tough conditions year round a bit of credit. I can, if asked, will send in the original or cleanded .wav format without a problem...

Also no offense taken... :Crazy_282:

This post has been edited by TooRisky: 19 July 2010 - 11:55 PM

[ReverendStrone]

Very interesting clip. Thanks for sharing it TR!

My first thought was I was hearing a bear with a young cub, but looking through the bear cub sound clips on the website Wash linked in his post above didn't yield any close matches for the high pitched squeaking in TooRisky's recording. Of course, we don't know the ages of the cubs in either scenario (perhaps the cubs recorded on the website are older and maybe tooRisky got a young one, resulting in a much higher "voice"?), so I would say it's impossible to rule bears out without some expert advice from someone like Dr Lynn Rogers or some other bear expert.

That said, we can't also rule out that he didn't snag the target species here. Maybe we're hearing a squatch with a juvenile? On the side arguing against that, the can lid being pushed in suggests an animal rather than something smart to me, plus something bipedal with hands could have carried the can away if it thought it had something of value in it. The can being left standing up could be coincidental, could suggest a smaller creature that didn't push it with enough force to turn it over, or it could suggest something with hands put it down - so that's a difficult one to nut out too. I don't think it's clear evidence arguing either way unfortunately. :(

I also wonder, knowing humans were nearby, would a sasquatch have risked making noise at all or just snuck in and swiped the can? Or maybe it was being careless and TooRisky got lucky - they have to mess up sometimes, right?

Looking for options other than a sas, another candidate that occured to me after listening to the audio was a wolverine. Are they known in the area? Might that be a wolverine mother with a cub? I looked up wolverine sounds on the website Wash linked for bear and found this clip of a group feeding. There are snarls and a few whimpers (it's quiet canine sounding really). If that is a group of grown wolverines feeding, mightn't a wolverine mother with a begging cub sound similar to what TooRisky recorded perhaps? It's another suggestion to consider anyways.

Thanks again for sharing it. It's certainly interesting!

[Drew]

How far is the location from the nearest airport?

The fourth sound file on the google site sounds like an airplane.

[Steenburg]

If I can make a suggestion. Next time you might want to take along a good size bag of flour. Spread it in a large circle around the bait on the ground and what ever is hanging around just might leave some identifying tracks? leave a narrow path through the flour for your own approach route.

Thomas Steenburg

[OregonMan]

^ Does this work for you?

We tried it a couple outings ago and the flour just sticks to the forest floor. We spread out a half bag or so and we tried walking through it, even trying to scuff it up and it sort of made a thick pitchy paste with everything on the ground.

It might work better in a dry spot later in the summer though.

[TooRisky]

ReverendStrone, on 28 July 2010 - 03:37 PM, said:

Very interesting clip. Thanks for sharing it TR!

My first thought was I was hearing a bear with a young cub, but looking through the bear cub sound clips on the website Wash linked in his post above didn't yield any close matches for the high pitched squeaking in TooRisky's recording. Of course, we don't know the ages of the cubs in either scenario (perhaps the cubs recorded on the website are older and maybe tooRisky got a young one, resulting in a much higher "voice"?), so I would say it's impossible to rule bears out without some expert advice from someone like Dr Lynn Rogers or some other bear expert.

That said, we can't also rule out that he didn't snag the target species here. Maybe we're hearing a squatch with a juvenile? On the side arguing against that, the can lid being pushed in suggests an animal rather than something smart to me, plus something bipedal with hands could have carried the can away if it thought it had something of value in it. The can being left standing up could be coincidental, could suggest a smaller creature that didn't push it with enough force to turn it over, or it could suggest something with hands put it down - so that's a difficult one to nut out too. I don't think it's clear evidence arguing either way unfortunately. :(

I also wonder, knowing humans were nearby, would a sasquatch have risked making noise at all or just snuck in and swiped the can? Or maybe it was being careless and TooRisky got lucky - they have to mess up sometimes, right?

Looking for options other than a sas, another candidate that occured to me after listening to the audio was a wolverine. Are they known in the area? Might that be a wolverine mother with a cub? I looked up wolverine sounds on the website Wash linked for bear and found this clip of a group feeding. There are snarls and a few whimpers (it's quiet canine sounding really). If that is a group of grown wolverines feeding, mightn't a wolverine mother with a begging cub sound similar to what TooRisky recorded perhaps? It's another suggestion to consider anyways.

Thanks again for sharing it. It's certainly interesting!

The baited area was over 100' from camp and up hill, the bait "Salmon with Juice" was spread about and is pretty potent... I can disregard bears because they are more boisterous, loud, and lumbering... A bear would not have left that can of Salmon sitting straight up with the lid pushed in and no teeth or claw marks on the can... Wolverine are not in this area though one was recently spotted up on Mount Rainier at about the 7000' level. So it would be like a 50/50 deal of seeing a BF or Wolverine as both are very rare, also Wolverine are worse than bear when finding a food source, they are relentless and that can would have be mauled.

ya know I am still looking for a known sound to compare this to, but the more I start to broach the idea of BF the more things seem to fit really well. It is funny because we cant say for sure but the evidence is what it is, this maybe as far as it goes. A person with all the evidence may have to just make the call themselves form here on out, thats the best I can
offer at this point and probably well into the future...

I have to give props to Mojo, my partner, for he was with me and has as much of what ever credit that is given for this.

.

This post has been edited by TooRisky: 30 July 2010 - 03:52 PM